Reform backs same-sex marriage ban challenge http://jta.org/ENTRY_PERMALINK_HERE/reform-movement-backs-challenge-to-calif-same-sex-marriage-ban/ The Union of Reform Judaism has joined a brief challenging the legality of a California ballot initiative banning same-sex marriage. en-us efingerhut@jta.org Copyright 2009 2009-01-14T;12:21:01-05:00 Comment by Marisa James waltzingmarisa@yahoo.com One more thing: for anyone who believes that gay marriage is not a “Jewish issue:” Judaism has always concerned itself with human rights, the ability of individuals to live lives of dignity, and the ability of Jews to create families. If my father fell seriously ill, and my mother was not allowed to visit my father in the hospital, I feel sure that my rabbi would work hard to make sure that she was able to gain entry. If my mother had died when I was a child and my brother and I had been given to someone other than my father to raise, I’m sure my rabbi would have intervened to allow my father to raise us. Is denying these basic rights to committed couples part of your Jewish value system? If so, perhaps I’m beginning to understand the apathy of the younger generations and the declining synagogue membership numbers across the US. One more thing: for anyone who believes that gay marriage is not a “Jewish issue:” Judaism has always concerned itself with human rights, the ability of individuals to live lives of dignity, and the ability of Jews to create families. If my father fell seriously ill, and my mother was not allowed to visit my father in the hospital, I feel sure that my rabbi would work hard to make sure that she was able to gain entry. If my mother had died when I was a child and my brother and I had been given to someone other than my father to raise, I’m sure my rabbi would have intervened to allow my father to raise us. Is denying these basic rights to committed couples part of your Jewish value system? If so, perhaps I’m beginning to understand the apathy of the younger generations and the declining synagogue membership numbers across the US.

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by Marisa James waltzingmarisa@yahoo.com I’m frankly amused by the sudden committment to halakha in the Reform world. May I ask if those of you with halakhic concerns about gay couples having wedding ceremonies also check to make sure that your garments are not made of a mix of wool and cotton? Because that’s also forbidden d’oraita (in the Torah). If you empty a mousetrap and accidentally touch the dead mouse, do you go to the mikveh to render yourself ritually clean again? Because “dead swarming things” (mice, flies) are an abomination, and one who touches them is unclean until sunset and purification, also from the Torah. I could go on, but I don’t think it’s necessary. But here’s a question: have a look and see what the Torah says about marriage. Really, please go look. Use a concordance if you need to. And it doesn’t matter which language you prefer, Hebrew or English. Forget “tikkun olam” for the moment; it’s an overused and misunderstood concept. Instead, consider this: the prohibition is against two men having anal intercourse. What about two men who want to marry who don’t have anal intercourse? (don’t laugh - not all gay men do.) What about two women? Please tell me what verses in the Torah forbid a marriage between two adults, and I will be happy to reconsider my position. I’m frankly amused by the sudden committment to halakha in the Reform world. May I ask if those of you with halakhic concerns about gay couples having wedding ceremonies also check to make sure that your garments are not made of a mix of wool and cotton? Because that’s also forbidden d’oraita (in the Torah). If you empty a mousetrap and accidentally touch the dead mouse, do you go to the mikveh to render yourself ritually clean again? Because “dead swarming things” (mice, flies) are an abomination, and one who touches them is unclean until sunset and purification, also from the Torah.

I could go on, but I don’t think it’s necessary. But here’s a question: have a look and see what the Torah says about marriage. Really, please go look. Use a concordance if you need to. And it doesn’t matter which language you prefer, Hebrew or English.

Forget “tikkun olam” for the moment; it’s an overused and misunderstood concept. Instead, consider this: the prohibition is against two men having anal intercourse. What about two men who want to marry who don’t have anal intercourse? (don’t laugh - not all gay men do.) What about two women? Please tell me what verses in the Torah forbid a marriage between two adults, and I will be happy to reconsider my position.

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by richard dent drumguy123@gmail.com Mr. Walk raises a good question that is not given much attention in the Reform and perhaps the larger Jewish community.  It deserves analysis. There is really nothing “Jewish” about the gay marriage issue, and certainly nothing in Jewish law or tradition that supports the attack on natural/traditional definition of marriage and family.  Typically, the rationale cited for this and other political and social causes is “justice” or “tikkun olam.” Sometimes it’s relatively clear: Darfur seems to be a good example.  There is no conflict between Jewish law and custom and trying to stop genocide and basic human sufferering. But this general concept is stretched in whatever direction someone wants.  Some Jews cite “tikkun olam” as a basis for opposing what I consider to be the right of the State of Israel to exist, and to defend itself. Mr. Walk’s distinction between what is appropriate for Jewish political organizations as distinct from Jewish religious organizations makes sense to me. Mr. Walk raises a good question that is not given much attention in the Reform and perhaps the larger Jewish community.  It deserves analysis.
There is really nothing “Jewish” about the gay marriage issue, and certainly nothing in Jewish law or tradition that supports the attack on natural/traditional definition of marriage and family. 
Typically, the rationale cited for this and other political and social causes is “justice” or “tikkun olam.” Sometimes it’s relatively clear: Darfur seems to be a good example.  There is no conflict between Jewish law and custom and trying to stop genocide and basic human sufferering.
But this general concept is stretched in whatever direction someone wants.  Some Jews cite “tikkun olam” as a basis for opposing what I consider to be the right of the State of Israel to exist, and to defend itself.
Mr. Walk’s distinction between what is appropriate for Jewish political organizations as distinct from Jewish religious organizations makes sense to me.

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by Gary Walk gwalk@caseyciklin.com Their tax exempt status should not be an issue.  501(c)(3) organizations are permitted to take non-partisan positions on political issues, and as an affiliate of a religious organization, the RAC may not even be a (c)(3) anyway.  What I am saying is that a Jewish religious organization (as opposed to a Jewish political organization) should have some regard for the Torah in its public positions. Their tax exempt status should not be an issue.  501(c)(3) organizations are permitted to take non-partisan positions on political issues, and as an affiliate of a religious organization, the RAC may not even be a (c)(3) anyway.  What I am saying is that a Jewish religious organization (as opposed to a Jewish political organization) should have some regard for the Torah in its public positions.

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by David Sternlight david@sternlight.com Fine. They should lose any 501(c)(3) tax status for interfering with the secular political process. Separation of Church and State cuts both ways. Fine. They should lose any 501(c)(3) tax status for interfering with the secular political process. Separation of Church and State cuts both ways.

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by daniel wade barry geronimo4@verizon.net as a christian who recenty looked in to this matter. homosexuality became walking after other gods which is protected by the constitution.however to recognize these religions we must establish the bible. I’m no legal scholar but I believe gay marriage if legalized, well set aside money for more jails.Cause you will destroy a generation./ as a christian who recenty looked in to this matter. homosexuality became walking after other gods which is protected by the constitution.however to recognize these religions we must establish the bible. I’m no legal scholar but I believe gay marriage if legalized, well set aside money for more jails.Cause you will destroy a generation./

]]> 2010-03-12T;16:04:00-05:00 Comment by Gary Walk gwalk@caseyciklin.com This raises an issue that I discussed with Rabbi Saperstein at a reception in Palm Beach Gardens on Sunday: is it appropriate for a Jewish organization to take a position based on consensus Jewish political beliefs, which is not grounded in Halacha?  The Torah contains passages which are inconsistent with same sex marriages, yet most Reform Jews, including me, believe that principles of individual liberty should trump the Torah’s proscriptions in matters of civil law.  Yet it still seems to me that a Jewish religious movement is on shaky ground taking a position that is clearly at odds with passages in the Torah.  I feel perfectly comfortable taking such position as an individual, but I am not comfortable with my movement taking the same position. Gary Walk Palm Beach Gardens, Florida This raises an issue that I discussed with Rabbi Saperstein at a reception in Palm Beach Gardens on Sunday: is it appropriate for a Jewish organization to take a position based on consensus Jewish political beliefs, which is not grounded in Halacha?  The Torah contains passages which are inconsistent with same sex marriages, yet most Reform Jews, including me, believe that principles of individual liberty should trump the Torah’s proscriptions in matters of civil law.  Yet it still seems to me that a Jewish religious movement is on shaky ground taking a position that is clearly at odds with passages in the Torah.  I feel perfectly comfortable taking such position as an individual, but I am not comfortable with my movement taking the same position.

Gary Walk
Palm Beach Gardens, Florida

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