OP-ED: What Obama must do first for peace http://jta.org/ENTRY_PERMALINK_HERE/op-ed-what-obama-needs-to-do-first/ President-elect Barack Obama should start his Middle East agenda by endorsing the Arab Peace Initiative -- the best offer the Arabs have ever made to Israel, M.J. Rosenberg writes. en-us mjrosenberg@jta.org Copyright 2008 2008-11-23T;16:42:03-05:00 Comment by David Hersch davidh@intekom.co.za The telling quote from Rosenberg’s episcle is “Our problem is to resolve a conflict that harms American interests throughout the Muslim world, and has done so since 1967.” This is naive and buys into the shallow and infantile propaganda that peace in the Middle east will change the Arabs’ attitude towards the West and the USA. All it means is that they are a step nearer their goals of conquest and taking over the world and can only encourage them. It shows no real understanding of the situation in the Middle East tied up with the Arab mentality. It shows how their intransigence is a good tactic from their perspective as we have no long term view or patience and the West is inclined to lose focus if things take too long to resolve, whilst they are the exact opposite. They give nothing, make no move, no conciliation, show no reason and in the end achieve their goals. They understand our psychology better than we do and how we don’t understand them at all. When I speak about “we”, I mean the West in general. As for Rosenberg admiring the Palestinian Authority’s adverts, it means nothing and as usual is war by other means, which they constantly apply and morph. Its part of a constant campaign to undermine the israelis and abuse people’s ignorance. It is a starnge phenomenon in the West how we seem to have no memory, forget the horrors, bombs, rockets, murders that were perpetrated just this morning or yesterday and we seem to accept that these people can do whatever they like when they like as this is their “nature”. I am afraid the the only real answer is real fear and complete, total and utter defeat of israel’s enemies. As in WWII where the Allies would only accept unconditional surrender from Japan and Germany and then went on to remake their societies, so we should apply this to the Palestinians. Talk, of course, but there is no other way it seems to bring these people into modernity, civilisation and common sense. Mr Rosenberg, Americas best interests continue to lie with a strong Israel. Knopw thy self, know they friends and especially, know they enemy, which I suspect you don’t really. The telling quote from Rosenberg’s episcle is “Our problem is to resolve a conflict that harms American interests throughout the Muslim world, and has done so since 1967.” This is naive and buys into the shallow and infantile propaganda that peace in the Middle east will change the Arabs’ attitude towards the West and the USA. All it means is that they are a step nearer
their goals of conquest and taking over the world and can only encourage them. It shows no real understanding of the situation in the Middle East tied up with the Arab mentality. It shows how their intransigence is a good tactic from their perspective as we have no long term view or patience and the West is inclined to lose focus if things take too long to resolve, whilst they are the exact opposite. They give nothing, make no move, no conciliation, show no reason and in the end achieve their goals. They understand our psychology better than we do and how we don’t understand them at all. When I speak about
“we”, I mean the West in general.

As for Rosenberg admiring the Palestinian Authority’s adverts, it means nothing and as usual is war by other means, which they constantly apply and morph. Its part of a constant campaign to undermine the israelis and abuse people’s ignorance.

It is a starnge phenomenon in the West how we seem to have no memory, forget the horrors, bombs, rockets, murders that were perpetrated just this morning or yesterday and we seem to accept that these people can do whatever they like when they like as this is their “nature”. I am afraid the the only real answer is real fear and complete, total and utter defeat of israel’s enemies. As in WWII where the Allies would only accept unconditional surrender from Japan and Germany and then went on to remake their societies, so we should apply this to the Palestinians. Talk, of course, but there is no other way it seems to bring these people into modernity, civilisation and common sense.

Mr Rosenberg, Americas best interests continue to lie with a strong Israel. Knopw thy self, know they friends and especially, know they enemy, which I suspect you don’t really.

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00 Comment by Howard Cohn fossilh@aol.com Mr. Rosenberg seems to have forgotten that the Saudi Plan was presented as a “Take it or leave it,” plan.  It is interesting that all of the ‘settlers’ must leave areas to be ruled by the Arabs without being offered the choice of staying under Arab rule.  It seems as if there is no place for Jews in some Arab territory.  Go back in time and read what was stated when the Saudi Plan was first presented.  Suicide is not an option Mr. Rosenberg seems to have forgotten that the Saudi Plan was presented as a “Take it or leave it,” plan.  It is interesting that all of the ‘settlers’ must leave areas to be ruled by the Arabs without being offered the choice of staying under Arab rule.  It seems as if there is no place for Jews in some Arab territory.  Go back in time and read what was stated when the Saudi Plan was first presented.  Suicide is not an option

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00 Comment by david singer dsinger2000@gmail.com The placement of these advertisements amount to a total - and highly public - repudiation of the Roadmap by the Palestinian Authority after almost six years of totally fruitless negotiations. The Bush Roadmap and the negotiating farce it represented is effectively ended once and for all by these ads. The Quartet - America, the European Union, Russia and the United Nations - will see its collective prestige in jointly endorsing and promoting the Roadmap finally come crashing to the ground without achieving one iota of movement in achieving the Roadmap‘s objectives. Those countries who have paid up on their pledges totalling US$7.7 billion dollars to the Palestinian Authority just 11 months ago must be aghast - as must those other countries who have contributed billions of more dollars in the last 15 years to a totally implacable and unyielding Palestinian Authority.  Rejecting 90% of what you want and holding out for 100% - and being supported in that rejection by a host of fawning nations eager to throw money at you - has been brought to an end by a few full page ads. The Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. The placement of these advertisements amount to a total - and highly public - repudiation of the Roadmap by the Palestinian Authority after almost six years of totally fruitless negotiations.

The Bush Roadmap and the negotiating farce it represented is effectively ended once and for all by these ads.

The Quartet - America, the European Union, Russia and the United Nations - will see its collective prestige in jointly endorsing and promoting the Roadmap finally come crashing to the ground without achieving one iota of movement in achieving the Roadmap‘s objectives.

Those countries who have paid up on their pledges totalling US$7.7 billion dollars to the Palestinian Authority just 11 months ago must be aghast - as must those other countries who have contributed billions of more dollars in the last 15 years to a totally implacable and unyielding Palestinian Authority. 

Rejecting 90% of what you want and holding out for 100% - and being supported in that rejection by a host of fawning nations eager to throw money at you - has been brought to an end by a few full page ads.

The Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00 Comment by Jordan saku16@aol.com Parts of this article are actually incorrect and there was some backtracking that the Obama team had to do particularly regarding his speech at AIPAC and the statement regarding the status of Jerusalem.  After Palestinian outcry, Obama had to issue a new statement that was more flexible. Now, contrary to the above statement, the settlers are in fact posing a problem and anyone who doesn’t see and accept this is intentionally trying to distort the reality.  I agree that the Arabs have a terrible double standard in not allowing Jews to live in a future Palestinian state while at the same time demanding non-Jews the ‘right of return’ to Israel, not to mention the Muslims who already do live in Israel as citizens.  It’s really a bizarre situation.  That said, there is a fringe element of settlers who are doing Israel no favor by attacking Palestinian olive harvesters etc.  The settlements were established to serve as a defensive buffer against the Arab armies.  The need for them today in general is really not there.  Everyone who disagrees is looking at things through a purely right-wing religious lens. These same people keep saying one thing or the other is God’s will.  Take the Neturei Karta for example.  They believe Israel should not have been reestablished… but who are they to say what is God’s will?  Because of their own personal interpretation of a text?  If it has been established, is it not the will of God?  Are they then implying that the power of man to create exceeds that of God? This is much like the settlements… decisions are made and are made to be realities for however long it is deemed necessary.  Leaving most of the West Bank, like how Israel left Gaza occurs only if God has decided so.  All of the religious fighting against it are the ones who truly need to look in the mirror and realize they are not God. It’s time to stop worrying about trivial no longer necessary settlements and look to the east at Iran.  There is the real danger to Israel and settlements won’t do a thing to help. Parts of this article are actually incorrect and there was some backtracking that the Obama team had to do particularly regarding his speech at AIPAC and the statement regarding the status of Jerusalem.  After Palestinian outcry, Obama had to issue a new statement that was more flexible.

Now, contrary to the above statement, the settlers are in fact posing a problem and anyone who doesn’t see and accept this is intentionally trying to distort the reality.  I agree that the Arabs have a terrible double standard in not allowing Jews to live in a future Palestinian state while at the same time demanding non-Jews the ‘right of return’ to Israel, not to mention the Muslims who already do live in Israel as citizens.  It’s really a bizarre situation.  That said, there is a fringe element of settlers who are doing Israel no favor by attacking Palestinian olive harvesters etc. 

The settlements were established to serve as a defensive buffer against the Arab armies.  The need for them today in general is really not there.  Everyone who disagrees is looking at things through a purely right-wing religious lens.

These same people keep saying one thing or the other is God’s will.  Take the Neturei Karta for example.  They believe Israel should not have been reestablished… but who are they to say what is God’s will?  Because of their own personal interpretation of a text?  If it has been established, is it not the will of God?  Are they then implying that the power of man to create exceeds that of God?

This is much like the settlements… decisions are made and are made to be realities for however long it is deemed necessary.  Leaving most of the West Bank, like how Israel left Gaza occurs only if God has decided so.  All of the religious fighting against it are the ones who truly need to look in the mirror and realize they are not God.

It’s time to stop worrying about trivial no longer necessary settlements and look to the east at Iran.  There is the real danger to Israel and settlements won’t do a thing to help.

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00 Comment by brent rubin brentlrubin@hotmail.com I think Mr Rosenberg is being a littel naive to think that also Israel has to do accept the preconditions of the Saudi Plan, There is no precedent in history where you accept the maximum unconditionally to negotiate for the minimum.  Does he truly believe that the Saudi Plan is in Israels best interest, because no before have any of these countries offered one ounce of peace. If you think that removing 10,000 people from Gaza was tough wait until you have to remove 300,000 from the West Bank and Samaria. Whose pocket is the funds coming from to pay for this fiasco. I think Mr Rosenberg is being a littel naive to think that also Israel has to do accept the preconditions of the Saudi Plan, There is no precedent in history where you accept the maximum unconditionally to negotiate for the minimum.  Does he truly believe that the Saudi Plan is in Israels best interest, because no before have any of these countries offered one ounce of peace. If you think that removing 10,000 people from Gaza was tough wait until you have to remove 300,000 from the West Bank and Samaria. Whose pocket is the funds coming from to pay for this fiasco.

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00 Comment by Victor Galindo agvglv@comline.com I rarely, if ever, agree with Mr. Rosenberg.  I strongly disagree with him now.  The Arabs can accept Jews living in Judea/Samaria just as Israelis have accepted Muslims in Israel.  The problem is not with the ‘settlers’, but with the Arabs wanting NO JEWS in a future state.  Even though the Jewish ties to Judea and Samaria are infinitely greater than either Muslim or Christian ties.  Even without such acceptance by the Arabs, it must be remembered that Egypt and Israel reached an agreement while settlers were still in the Sinai.  This entire ‘settler’ business is merely a smoke screen. I rarely, if ever, agree with Mr. Rosenberg.  I strongly disagree with him now.  The Arabs can accept Jews living in Judea/Samaria just as Israelis have accepted Muslims in Israel.  The problem is not with the ‘settlers’, but with the Arabs wanting NO JEWS in a future state.  Even though the Jewish ties to Judea and Samaria are infinitely greater than either Muslim or Christian ties.  Even without such acceptance by the Arabs, it must be remembered that Egypt and Israel reached an agreement while settlers were still in the Sinai.  This entire ‘settler’ business is merely a smoke screen.

]]> 2009-11-22T;22:02:00-05:00